User talk:Zinkshipper

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SF? Is that you?

Yes, it is. But I didn't want anyone to know that I'm actually a white woman from Germany. It spoils the whole "Stormfreak is a filthy nigger not fit to be in our company" part of the wank.

Actually I thought Zinkshipper might be you straight up (as opposed to a friend of SF's) because of the Nona Gaye and the Zink (who are extremely hot) thing. Your LJ is on my friendsfriends, so it was familiar.--Mindset 20:44, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
Warning! Most of this is tl;dr!
Well, I come into this wank around fall of 2003. That semester, there was a very ill-received (but well-intended) Town Hall-style race discussion that was held at FSU, with student from FAMU and TCC attending, and (I think) 3 student representatives from every school. SF, of course, was one of the FAMU reps; my roommate at the time (a very sweet, we-are-the-world kind of woman) was on the FSU staff. Started out very Kumbayaish and descended into third level of Hell. It was meant to be an hour long, but I think it ended after 20 minutes. And I thought SF was the meanest person alive. She left my roommate a sobbing heap in front of the entire audience! You would think her real life persona would be very loud and abrasive, but she's quite soft-spoken (I'm ALWAYS asking her to repeat herself), but with a very intimidating presence. Anyway, if you read that customers_suck wank before it got bahleeted and you got to see any of her posts, then you'll have a good idea of what happened overall - the Plucky White Good-Intentioned Liberal up against the Surly, Couldn't-Care-Less-About-Race-Relations Semi-Conservative. Pretty much the same ending, too; the liberal moved herself from the debacle; while SF found the whole thing pretty funny and made no apologies.
Fast forward to the release of Matrix Revolutions a few months later (and not Reloaded like I originally thought) and it's the very first showing at noon at the mall, and I see SF standing in the line. By this time, my roommate had quit the Flambeaux and was kind of slipping away, academically, and a small part of that was due to what happened at the meeting. I just walked right up to her and just let her have it. I'm going off about how people like her are part of the problem and not the solution and making all sorts of assumptions while fighting on behalf of someone else who never asked me to speak on her behalf in the first place (Zinkshipper, champion of the misunderstood since 1980!), and she has this completely blank stare on her face. Suddenly, she says out of the blue, "Oh, I remember that." And it occured to me then that she really didn't remember any of what I was talking about up until that moment; she probably hadn't even thought of the meeting since the minute it was over. To her, it was nothing personal; FAMU sent her to to a job, and she did it. All of that anger that my roommate and I (and a good deal of FSU's student body) had towards her had been completely wasted, because she hadn't given us a second thought. Not because she was better than anyone or anything like that, but because it wasn't anything personal to her! She actually give me a ride home that day because my car wouldn't start, after I'd just cursed her out three hours prior. (And when we saw that we both agreed that Nona Gaye would've made the perfect Storm, we were pretty much BEST FRIENDS 4 EVA!!11) Once we found out that we were both Storm crazy, that's when I found out that she had a forum and a website for Storm stories (I'd never even heard of fanfic or fandoms before that), and I joined the message board until she closed it down about a year later. I don't think I did a lot of posting at the Haven at all, and I didn't take part in any of the wanks because they were mostly archived at that time. The big problem is that just about everything that was related to any of the SF wanks that were mentioned on the boards were members-only boards, or archived for the Haven staff only. If they hadn't been, I would've been able to Wayback it; as it stand now, it (hopefully) isn't that important anymore. Rest assured, if it DOES become "that important" again, then I'll be all over it, giving my side until I'm silenced just like SF was.
I mention all of this to tie to the whole wanking thing. From what I could see from my little corner of the fandom, SF never took any of it personally until it directly interfered with the people in her real life. And not just her school either. She was writing professionally for a web site whose name slips my mind at the minute, and THOSE PEOPLE were even contacted. (No link of proof; it's all Haven locked. And it turned out to be a non-issue, because her editor-in-chief was actually a Haven member and didn't even know that the person he'd employed was writing stories that he enjoyed.) Everything up until then - accusations of Caucasian-hating, award fixing, ego-tripping, and overall psychotic behavior, mind you - wasn't that big of a deal. The only thing she's ever denied was the Attack of the Block Texting Trolls. Now, like I said, I didn't come into it until somewhere towards the end of it all. But what I've noticed - and I think most people will agree - is that Stormfreak pretty much owns up to everything that FW says happened. Rude behaviour? Check. Posting pictures of people and calling them ugly? Check. Being a egotistical, wanking jackass? Check. So I never really understood what the issue ever was to begin with. Naturally, I have my theories, but hopefully it's all a non-issue now.
Annnnyway, as for accusations of sockpuppeteering, that's just juvenile and wanky, and smacks of "We don't like you because you're her friend". I had a Haven account, but the name escapes me; it was FSU related and I could count on one hand the amount of times that I ever posted. As for our Nona Gaye message board, it's had four incarnations (on ProBoards, phpBB, Invision and now Simple Machines), and I've been an admin for all four of them, diffusing some of the most ree-damn-diculous wank that your eyes have been blessed to have never seen. (IncestGate alone took up nearly three weeks. That's a wiki all its own.) In fact, I just got publicly smacked down by SF for going at it with another moderator from another board. (The irony, it burrrrrns!) That's a LOT of activity for just one person, don't you think?
And as far as I'm concerned, we should all get together and admire the hotness that is the Zink. It'll cure what ails ya! Zinkshipper 12:17, 18 January 2006 (GMT)
heh! the racist accusations...in record time! Good lord, you don't believe in foreplay, do you? Most of us would have started gradual -- maybe with an accusation of insensitivity toward certain sections of a light-splitting prism -- and worked our way up. -- wankprophet
Okay! Zinkshipper 16:21, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
It's actually the racist accusations that have me thinking you're just here to troll. If you can provide a link to where anyone in F_W said this: "Stormfreak is a filthy nigger not fit to be in our company" (or any variation thereof), then do so, but other than that, keep the racist stuff out of your account. There's no real problem with your edits besides that.--Snacky 17:25, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
It's actually the racist accusations that have me thinking you're just here to troll.
You have to admit, I'm a very dull troll.
Nevertheless, since the racist aspect of the wank is one of the few aspects of the wank that's yet to be disputed (along with the picture wank, and any other Big Meanie Shit that Stormfreak did), I don't see any reason to leave it out of my account. After all, you have no proof of the block text, but I don't see anyone saying that needs to be left out. In fact, no one here has any proof that the original wank ever took place...but what do you know, here we are, nearly three years after the fact.
It's funny. I originally started this out as some grand plan to point out a few holes in the SF legend and spread a little bit of that blame around, but now I'm starting to wonder if SF should even be in this wiki at all, for no other reason than no one can prove than any of these wanks ever took place. All we seem to have is a FWGH account, secondhand, with a lot of posts saying things like "I wasn't there when..." or "I don't recall..."or "I don't remember...". But for some reason, we're supposed to take it all as undisputed FW gospel? Zinkshipper 18:09, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
Heh. Well, you know, I think Stormfreak admits that the wanks took place (she was correcting erroneous information in the FWGH account), and I know *I* read them on all three versions of F_W, and I've been saying what I do recall. I know, two sides to every story, and you've no reason to believe me. But I've no reason to lie, either. Just as I don't think you do. So, there we go. --Snacky 18:20, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
For my own benefit, since you say you read the original LJ wank (I assume there was electricity back then), do you happen to remember what the original wank was even about? That's the one thing that no one can seem to remember. I feel like I'm reading a book with the first few chapters missing. Obviously, you can say that the FW wank was about SF eating babies and I can't dispute that, but I'm just interested if you remember anything about it. Zinkshipper 18:49, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
Heh, after all this time and all these wanks, I should remember? *reaches for my cane* Okay, this may be wrong because of all the time past, but what I recall is two LJ wanks - one about the comicfic awards, and a second about how she didn't like F_W (which, of course, brought all the comic stuff up again). I remember people getting very nasty in the comments - I think it was a lot of arguing between SF and the Subreality people. I think the second one came very close to our TOSing from LJ, too. Anyway, that's what I remember, but yeah, definitely a long time, so take with a grain of salt. --Snacky 19:19, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
Heh, I will admit you're a very dull troll. But no, the racist stuff is being edited out, because, while I don't dispute that some X-Men fandom members had racist disputes with Stormfreak, it can't be attributed to the F_W community in general.
Let me add - the block text stuff is standing because most people (including myself) remember it. I can't find anyone who remembers "Stormfreak is a filthy nigger not fit to be in our company" being said on F_W (or any variation thereof). --Snacky 18:13, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
Most people seem to remember the racial attacks as well. This is the first I've ever heard it being disputed. Just sayin'...Zinkshipper 18:19, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
Once again, I'm not disputing them, as I've said. Please do not twist what I said. I'm just disputing the implication that they originated from the F_W community.--Snacky 18:42, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
And the accusations of block text? That's going to stand because FW said it's so? Interesting.
I'm sorry, the posting of block text? Not a question. That SF was responsible for it? No proof, and she denies it. I'm not editing that part out.--Snacky 18:42, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
It should be noted that nowhere in my post did I suggest that FW is racist. I simply noted that the real life attacks against SF - which originated from the RL information posting over at Blurty - were of a racist nature, one of those GAU (generally agreed upon) facts. I'm interested in knowing why you don't want anyone to know that. And if we don't discuss that, then we can't discuss Stormfreak's "kill whitey" attitude, and I KNOW everyone wants to see evidence of that! Zinkshipper 18:17, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
What are you talking about, that I don't want people knowing? Please do not attribute motivations to me. All I want is it to be clear that the attacks did not come from the F_W membership as a whole and I edited this part: "Perhaps the most disturbing aspect of this wank is the fact that no one disagrees that racially motivated attacks were made against Stormfreak; nor has anyone (so far) claimed that the attacks never happened. The general defense of said attacks is that Stormfreak deserved it because Stormfreak was a jerk, and her coworkers and friends deserved it for no other reason than sharing a room with her" because where is this "general defense"? I've never seen anyone making this claim that real-life racial attacks were justified because "Stormfreak was a jerk". If you can show me where this is and who said it, I'd appreciate it. --Snacky 18:42, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
That's a general "you" there. A little too much glossing over for me. I can provide a few links to what I perceive as people having a "so what" attitude, but that'll have to come later this evening, sorry. For the record, I'm not trying to say that no one seems to care that the attacks were racially motivated; what I'm saying is that no one seems to care about the real life attacks, period, and no one seems to care that an entire staff of college students that didn't have a damned thing to do with the wank had to suffer behind that. Zinkshipper 18:55, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
I care about the real life attacks, and I think it sucks mightily that someone got a whole staff of college students involved in online fandom foolishness, and made them suffer over it. Unfortunately, I wasn't a mod at the time, so there wasn't anything I could do about it. I *did* email SF back then over the whole wank, and (of course, I didn't save a copy of the email from three years ago, heh, so I'm paraphrasing) I believe I said I understood why she did what she did then.--Snacky 19:13, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
What you're not getting here... that Stormfreak's college got racist calls? No one here says that didn't happen, because we simply have no idea. If it did, that is terrible. That fandom_wank had anything to do with it? Being denied. There is no proof thereof; no one here has claimed responsibility; that's not what f_w does in general, and, as Snacky said, she and others would never have tolerated it. That someone posted Stormfreak's personal information? Not being denied, though no one here remembers it. That the mods refused to delete said posts? Denied; there were no mods on blurty, so that can't be true. That block text was posted? Not being denied, even by Stormfreak on the FWGH thread. Stormfreak was held responsible for it by the JFA. That Stormfreak herself did it? That, you're denying. Both sides agree there was a wank on LJ. Both sides agree there was a wank on Blurty. Both sides agree there was wank on JF and block text posting. Both sides agree Stormfreak was eventually banned from F_W. Saying there's no proof of things on which both sides agree seems pointless. -- Avocado 18:27, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
That fandom_wank had anything to do with it? Being denied.
Let's see. Personal information about SF was posted on FW, and not deleted by the powers that be. By SHEER COINCIDENCE, the staff of SF's college newspaper got email/phone bombed. Nope, I don't see why ANYONE would connect that with FW!
Ah, but you see, that's where we get into trouble. The attribution of block text posting to Stormfreak is the same sort of argument, and you dispute that she's responsible. -- Avocado 19:35, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
That someone posted Stormfreak's personal information? Not being denied, though no one here remembers it.
Oh, PLEASE. It wouldn't take me but about 10 minutes to link up some posts that prove that people DO remember. It's just that most of it's has been dismissed as no big deal. Zinkshipper 18:55, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
No, I think posting personal information is a big deal, and I think Snacky does as well. I have heard it alleged that it was done. If so, it's deplorable. -- Avocado 19:35, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
That the mods refused to delete said posts? Denied; there were no mods on blurty, so that can't be true.
Again, bull. Whoever started the community had deleting options; they didn't use them. In fact, if Blurty is run like FW is run, then whoever actually started the wank actually had the ability to delete the posts, because the posts were made in that person's thread. So what you want people to believe is that once something is posted on a Blurty community, that NO ONE can go and delete it. I guess the only thing we can do is is simply open up a Blurty community and see if that's true. Zinkshipper 18:49, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
You have stated the mods refused to delete Stormfreak's personal information. I'm saying there weren't mods. -- Avocado 19:35, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
That block text was posted? Not being denied, even by Stormfreak on the FWGH thread.
Neither are the racial attacks, but you are bound and determined to make sure they're never spoken of again. Zinkshipper 18:49, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
I'm sorry, what? Where on earth do you get that? I have made no attempt to edit the article. -- Avocado 19:35, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
Saying there's no proof of things on which both sides agree seems pointless.
Then why is it that this wank isn't limited to the things that both sides agree upon? This isn't something as simple as a difference of opinion. We're talking about stuff that can't even be linked to, and that's a big damn difference. Zinkshipper 18:49, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
And if you'd like to go the route that Snacky suggested with a further addition that we request Stormfreak not be discussed on f_w, any associated community, or JF at large, we can do that. -- Avocado 19:35, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
Dude, let's just do that. She agreed, and I'll post a reminder not to discuss SF on f_w, or any of the wank communities or JF as a whole.--Snacky 19:49, 17 January 2006 (GMT)

FYI, there might be a possibility of a temp-ban here, because another person has been temp-banned for doing a dramatic edit before...

Certainly I wouldn't be banned for linking facts, posts, screencaps that just so happen to refute a large part of Fandom Wank's Stormfreak entry, would I?

But to be honest, I hope you won't be, because (a) the Stormfreak article really did need some more detail, and (b) even though I can recall 95% of what happened on the comic fandom side, I really didn't want to write it because of my involvement in the matter, as minor as it was.

In other words, you knew the majority of what was posted was garbage, but you lacked the integrity to set the story straight. That's okay! That's why I'm here - er, I mean back. Yeah, back. Because I'm Stormfreak. No, really! I am! I AM!

Besides, I have a huge reluctance to dig up the dirt in my own fandom...

Of course you are.

...which might be one of the reasons why there aren't any articles about some of the legendary wankers yet.

I'm sure it wouldn't matter - it seems that Stormfreak the Great Big Crazy Meanie has enough meat for people to feed on for another four or five years.

So I'm actually glad of your edits... but be aware, if your words are kept, they might be re-edited one way or another, because that's the way the wiki is.

I'm sure they will be - in fact, I'm sure the entire article will get deleted, reverted back to that half-cocked piece of garbage that it was, and then locked altogether. The people at blackfolk are practically running a pool on it. If I could get banned around the 23rd, I'd appreciate it. That way I'll have enough money to get the brakes on my car fixed!

It must be nice to be able to recreate history the way you wish it had gone down. Too bad Fandom Wank doesn't have that kind of power over Germany. --Zinkshipper 05:52, 17 January 2006 (GMT)


SF? Is that you?

FYI, there might be a possibility of a temp-ban here, because another person has been temp-banned for doing a dramatic edit before (although, at the time, nobody was aware that person was who the article was about, and the admin I thought it was a random weird overly defensive fangirl and the admin agreed).

But to be honest, I hope you won't be, because (a) the Stormfreak article really did need some more detail, and (b) even though I can recall 95% of what happened on the comic fandom side, I really didn't want to write it because of my involvement in the matter, as minor as it was. (I'm Brucha on LJ, there was a minor flamewar during the CBFFAs in my journal because I'd mentioned SF and one of the other comicficcers took the opportunity to voice her opinion... you know the drill; and also I'd mentioned SF's real name in the fwgreatesthits post not realizing that the privacy matter was one of the whole instigations of the situation. Besides, I have a huge reluctance to dig up the dirt in my own fandom, which might be one of the reasons why there aren't any articles about some of the legendary wankers yet.)

So I'm actually glad of your edits... but be aware, if your words are kept, they might be re-edited one way or another, because that's the way the wiki is. It's not free of bias like Wikipedia, but really, I do like most of what you've put in and think it ought to stay. I can't speak for anyone else though, and I'm no mod, so... anyway... --Mindset 05:38, 17 January 2006 (GMT)

I've been watching the edits since they began. I suppose I should have mentioned that. I'm not seeing any reason to ban. I've also made no attempts to revert the article. -- Avocado 06:17, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
I have a few quibbles with the edits, but they're not cause for banning. However, I'm starting to get a troll feeling from the tone here in this discussion, but... we can watch it.--Snacky 17:15, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
Agreed. -- Avocado 18:27, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
Well, I think I've made up my mind now. :-) --Snacky 15:10, 18 January 2006 (GMT)
Again, absolutely agreed. She was given every chance. Oh, and where the heck are you viewing IPs on the wiki? -- Avocado 15:49, 18 January 2006 (GMT)
I was only worried because of what happened with Gigaprincess/Heidi. Also, I knew some people would defensively try to revert automatically (which did happen), and editing wars are lame. --Mindset 20:44, 17 January 2006 (GMT)
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